Speaker 1 00:00
It was about understanding what makes people tick, what are their skills, their strengths, what
do they love to do, and are we stopping and asking people those questions. So I think his
influence from a very early age that has influenced our entire company and the vision that he's
brought to life. Every one of us needs to consider, you know, our purpose. Why are we here?
How can we make a contribution to the place that we are, to our workplace, to our families, to
our community? And how do we make the world better through our contribution? And that's
part of what we love to do, we want to equalize and offer opportunity for those youth who are
hungry, who are driven to success, and we're here as a pathway to a future.
Speaker 2 00:56
Welcome back to CEO Behind the Scenes. I'm your host, Fred Fuller. Today we will be
discussing what it takes to build a business where profit and purpose aren't competing
priorities, but confluent to the same objective. Joining us is Karen Meredith, the CEO of Drake
International. Drake International is celebrating a 75 year legacy of not just placing people in
jobs, but on actually changing lives. In this episode, we will unpack the founding vision behind
Drake, how that purpose is being reimagined for today's workforce, and why investing in people
may be one of the most powerful strategies in an AI world. Karen, welcome to the show. How
are you?
Speaker 1 01:35
I'm great, Fred. Glad to be here.
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Speaker 2 01:38
Well, it's great to have you. Well, we'll just jump right in. What do you say?
Speaker 1 01:42
Love it. All
Speaker 2 01:43
right. Why don't we start by going back to the beginning and talking a little bit about Bill
Pollack. What is it about his story that helped shape Drake?
Speaker 1 01:52
Well, Bill Pollock is a force. He's a guy who had ideas before ideas were in the realm of
business. He was thinking about the future and how he was going to do good in the world. So,
let me tell you his story. He's a young man who's grown up in Canada, in a place called
Winnipeg, and he was the ninth child of a blue collar railway working family, and this is back in
the Depression era, and the influences I think back then were about how is it that people can
find work, find jobs in order to feed their family, and as a young guy he was exposed to those
sort of thoughts, so I think his influence from a very early age, he was thinking about what do
people do to earn money to serve their families with food to make a living and to just be
successful, whatever success looked like, and so he was influenced from this early age back in
the Depression era, and that has influenced our entire company and the vision that he's
brought to life.
Speaker 2 03:04
Do you have an idea where that visionary trait came from?
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Speaker 1 03:10
You know, I've heard stories - he's a storyteller, Bill Pollock, and so I have heard stories about
how he didn't have a lot growing up, and I think when people don't have a lot, and this is back
before technology, of course. Your curiosity, your imagination, your art of the possible is really
what you hold on to. And so I think, as a young man, as his working-class family in the ninth
child, I'm sure that it was hard times. One of the stories that stands out for me is he would talk
about how his home backed onto the rail yards and the trains would be coming around a corner
and they would slow down before they were getting into the city, and he said that as these
trains slowed down, what he called the travelers, what you and I might call a hobo, would jump
off the train, and he said inevitably these guys would come to his house because they were
kind of close by, and he's sitting on the back stoop and he's watching these guys jump off, and
they would come and look for a handout, and I think the stories that were told to him by the
travelers, by these people who back in that time were looking for a better life, looking for work,
I think it influenced him, and it gave him ideas of far away lands and the art of the possible,
and I'm convinced that that is part of our origin story.
Speaker 2 04:49
Necessity is the mother of invention, right?
Speaker 1 04:52
Yep,
Speaker 2 04:53
so Drake has always positioned itself in the business of changing lives, right. We said that
earlier that. It's not just about putting people in jobs, it's about changing lives. How does that
philosophy show up in how Drake operates today?
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Speaker 1 05:08
I'll go back for a second to that origin story, and to your point that as people are looking to put
food on the table for their families, and they're looking to be productive and successful, but
also happy, you know, it's all about how dare you, how dare you be happy, but if you love what
you do, are you really working a day, right? And so, as Bill was forming the organization, it was
about understanding what makes people tick? What are their skills, their strengths? What do
they love to do? And are we stopping and asking people those questions? And so what Bill did
in those early days was really, in fact, look at people through a new, different lens. It was like,
how do we create the greatest potential of this individual and help them provide for their
families, and that was really what the business was all about. It was about helping people find
their potential and put food on the table, and in fact, back in the day, when the organization
started. We were putting women to work. This is before it was a thing, and so Bill would say
that most of the Drake employees were in fact women, and most of the employees that we
were going out into the market to help them find jobs were women, and this was not a thing
back in the 50s, and so we were pioneering, putting women into the workforce and building the
potential from the earliest days. I
Speaker 2 06:50
can't imagine the opposition right there. Had to have been a lot of people that were like, man,
you are breaking the rules, you're outside of the box, and this is not okay.
Speaker 1 07:00
As he tells the stories. In those early days, they had security, because as women, often married
women, were leaving the house to come and get a job, the husbands would actually come after
them and say, "No, I'm not allowing my partner to work. And so imagine the change, the
transformation that he had to go through, and it was all about educating, it was educating the
society and businesses, and he talks about sales, and how back in the day there were no sales
people that were women, and so he called them customer service representatives, and so as
we worked with businesses, it was about service, and it was about helping, but he said women
were the best sales people, because they were so service-oriented.
Speaker 2 07:50
A lot of leaders see profit and purpose as trade-offs. A lot of leaders, you can't have both, you
can't be happy and be profitable or make money. Why do you think that that persists? Why do
you think that's still a problem in the world today, or a thought process, not a problem?
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Speaker 1 08:07
Well, I think a lot of businesses understand that doing good, it's a good thing, but it's off to the
side as a function versus infused in the identity of the organization, the culture, the values, and
in our organization we do not see profit and purpose as a trade off at all. In fact, they coexist. It
is our value set, it is our culture about helping people, as I said earlier, find their potential, and
so everything we do as an organization is tested against those values, and it has been from the
day we started, and it is 75 years later, just woven through the fabric, and to your point on AI,
it's about people, I think that AI is going to transform the world, just like when we look back at
the age of the internet, that was also transformational, and AI is just amping it up a whole new
level, but what that's doing is it's really focusing in on what makes people people, right? And
it's not all perfection, right? It is about progress and looking at, you call it the soft skills, it's
what makes people people, creativity, imagination, feelings, ethics, judgment, context, all of
this stuff that we, I don't want to say, have taken for granted, but AI is going to do things
magically, and then people, we need to double down on what makes a person exceptional and
contribute to business and the world, and so to us recognizing those human side, the people
that is the purpose, and that's going to help profit, and so to us it's all about profit in. And
purpose together,
Speaker 2 10:01
and when that purpose is real, and when it's felt, it's, it's an accelerator to performance, right?
it's a multiplier of performance, is that, is that your experience, that's what you see
consistently in the ethos, and in the, in the world that you, you've created
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Speaker 1 10:17
100% and that's really because I think again, as people, we have to step back and ask
ourselves all the time, why am I doing what I'm doing? What is my purpose as an individual?
We talk about leaving ripples, every one of us needs to consider, you know, our purpose. Why
are we here? How can we make a contribution to the place that we are to our workplace to our
families to our community and how do we make the world better through our contribution and
that's part of what we love to do from those early days of looking at a person's potential and
saying how do we match that with what they're exceptional at what are their skills, their
knowledge, and their behaviors, and how do we really understand that in contrast to what a
company, a job, and then how do we do a match, and then you go and you're successful, so
again it's that purpose and the profit they coexist, so 75 years doing something so different,
blazing a new trail, going against sort of modern conventions, if you will. What does the next 75
years look like? I think back 75 years ago, how different it was, and could we have ever
imagined the way it is today? So I think we are going to have to put on our magical thinking
hats as we think 75 years out, but moving it back, I think we've had some fundamentals. We
have been a company that's always embraced technology, you know. When the company was
founded, Bill was a salesman for a company called the Burroughs Corporation, and he was
selling something called a comptometer, which was a very simple calculating machine back in
the day, and then he got this great idea, which was instead of just selling equipment, I'm going
to find people and train them how to use this equipment, and I'm not going to sell equipment or
the trained people, I'm going to sell an outcome, and that was the magic of those early days
where he said it's technology, it's trained people who love what they do and are good at it, and
I'm going to sell to a company an outcome, and so when I think about the next 75 years, and I
think about AI, and I think about our purpose-led mission of helping people do what they love
and be great at it. It is going to be about outcomes, and so it's going to be about help
businesses understand what did they really need to accomplish, and for people, what makes
them thrive, and that is the one plus one equals three, because if we can help businesses be
successful, and we can help people, it's this match made in heaven. And so I think the next 75
years we're continuing on the journey. I think AI is going to just speed it up, accelerate the
mission that we're on, and that's what makes it exciting, and also pretty scary, because it is a
strap your seat belt on, like we are going so fast. The pace of change is incredible, and for us
it's about actively listening to the market, understanding the needs, seeing how AI is changing
everyday work, and what does that mean to the future of work, and it's about active listening,
asking questions, understanding context, and that's what we've always done, and we're going
to just continue on that path, and it's exciting, the
Speaker 2 13:53
commitment that the organization has to that, you've already kind of said it, but if you could
elaborate a little more on it's about understanding the market, it's about understanding the
both sides of the equation, right. It's a network business, basically, right. It's an early, early
stage network business that you've created. Nobody called it that then, those words that term
didn't exist, but that is what it is. And so the commitments that you make to continue to
demonstrate that growth rely on the market, and how you view the market, and how you
educate yourself. Could you talk just a little bit more about that?
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Speaker 1 14:30
What's incredible about our organization? We have a global footprint, so we have grown from
one country, went to two to three, and today we're represented in over 120 countries around
the world, like that's mind blowing. We have a network of partners, and our offices truly cover
the globe, and that's just like astonishing. So, as we think about the future and the work. That
we're doing, we're committed to what we call globally local understanding our local
communities, but leveraging the global, the power of using technology and being very scale
oriented, like this is about understanding how we're going to continue to expand and grow
deeper relationships and connections again through listening, active listening, asking
questions, better understanding, and so commitments to us in terms of that globally, local, it is
about community, it is about where we operate and the people we operate with, one of the
initiatives that you know we're really proud of is we have partnered with an organization, and
they are now part of our family, called the White Board Collective. The Whiteboard Collective is
now a Drake organization that helps with high needs youth with high potential helping them
better understand who they are and give them access to opportunities that they may not
otherwise have had, and so we're really proud of that initiative that we've taken, the
investment we're putting our dollars behind our commitment in order to really drive these
success stories, and although the Whiteboard Collective today is centered out of Canada, we're
excited that we're going to be reaching that global audience of high needs, high potential
youth, which, by the way, is again going back to our origin story, a tribute to Bill Pollock,
because at his young age he got a scholarship to go to university, and he had an opportunity
because he hadn't had access until that was provided to him. So the White Bird Collective is
really a tribute to our next 75 years, but based on where we've come from.
Speaker 2 17:03
When you say high needs youth, if you don't mind me asking a little bit more about that, tell
me what does that mean.
Speaker 1 17:09
I think youth today, and I'm a mom of five children, so I'll tell you we all have high needs, but in
this particular case, when we look at youth who may not be connected for whatever reason, it
may be because of a language, they may be new immigrants, they may not have access to the
network due to a socioeconomic status. There's lots of reasons why people are unable to be
granted, you know, an opportunity, and there's privilege, so we are looking at what we would
call high-needs youth people who have not had the same access, and we want to equalize and
offer opportunity for those youth who are hungry, who are driven to success, and we're here as
a pathway to a future,
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Speaker 2 18:03
and just out of curiosity, not to go too far on this tangent, but do you see social media? Have
you seen a shift because of social media? Because one of the challenges with social media is
that, like, hey, you're closer to everybody, but you're also further away. It's perplexing and
interesting to me. I, too, have three children. I am the second youngest of five kids, and so no
matter the world you live in, you know, the nature and nurture thing, and that you know they
all grew up in the same house, like they're different, they're all different, and they have very
different needs, and there's so many influences in the outside world, and they all hit different,
and so this is something I could spend two hours talking about easily, yeah. And I look at this
and I say, thank you, Karen. Like, thank you for thinking about that, because purpose in youth,
if young people don't have purpose, it's hard to engage.
Speaker 1 18:56
Well, I think it's interesting with technology, and what social media has done is, again, it's
compressed the world into these sound bites, headlines, and while there's some good, I also
think what ends up happening is, if we're just, you know, scrolling and looking at the headlines,
are we losing the context, are we losing, you know, it's the tip of the iceberg, what's beneath,
we know that there's so much more, and so I think there's a role to be played in using social
media in order to attract, and there's a lot of razzle dazzle that we can find the attention for
youth, but then it's about grabbing on and saying there's more, and how are we going to help
with more, and so I look at my kids, and you've just, you know, said it with your children. I've
got five very unique children, and each of them have strengths, and like all of us, they have
weaknesses, and it's about understanding, just like Bill Pollock said, the very early what are. Of
strengths, and how do we really understand how we're going to help you be the best that you
can be in whatever it is you choose to be as a unique individual. What we hear about AI is that
the on-ramp to employment is being eliminated, and that's because youth today, these entrylevel
jobs, the repeatable tasks, the in office or on site is being replaced by technology and
hybrid, and so I think we are in such a world of transformation right now where everyone is
trying to figure it out and lean in, but doesn't quite know what the outcome is going to be, and
so for us it's exciting because we're part of what I call the solutioning, and we also have to
figure out what's the problem we're trying to solve for, and I think that's where we're able to
anchor into our 75 years of history, think of 75 years in the journey we have seen it and done it
through cycle after cycle after cycle, and so there's some muscle memory there, and we're able
to double down on the resilience that this organization has had to showcase, and that's what
we're leaning into for the next 75 years, it's about problem solving, understanding, and then
being a first mover with youth, because youth is the future, and helping one step at a time.
Speaker 2 21:35
Is this ignored? Do you think by most people in the market this sort of need to grasp and pull,
and I think differentiate, right? So, the purpose piece, do you think that's largely ignored by
most, or do you think the rest of the kind of the working world and leadership in general is
catching on?
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Speaker 1 21:55
I see different perspectives. I think that there's a lot of fads and and I think we've seen that
over the last where certain initiatives are funded or have profile, and I think what's different
about our organization is we tend to actually be quiet about it. It's just part of our ethos, it's
who we are. It's our value system, and we lean into it, and it's not something that we have to
talk about in the market. It's just something that we do as a part of our culture.
Speaker 2 22:35
I wish you would talk about it more. I think more pity, more people need to hear it, more people
need to think about it. I think it's taken all too lightly, and the nature of how critical it is for us
to have purpose as human beings. It's interesting to talk about 75 years and what you've seen
change. You've seen so many things change in the workforce, between computers, precomputers,
the internet, email, all these different things, but still at its core, people are the
same, right?
Speaker 1 23:03
They are, that's the constant.
Speaker 2 23:06
Well, Karen, that is incredible. Are there any other initiatives that you guys have underway, or
is that kind of the biggest one?
Speaker 1 23:12
Well, you know, I'm excited to talk about what we call the Drake Force for Good Day. So, June 1
being our 75th anniversary, we are launching an annual commitment every June 1 in the world
to be a force for good, and our organization is going to be creatively finding ways to give back
and to amplify our ability to create change in the communities that we operate in around the
world, and so I'm really excited about that initiative as well. We're launching a partnership with
the University of Manitoba, which is the origin story of our company, where Bill Pollock went to
school and received a scholarship enabling education, which offered him this opportunity to
build this business. So, our partnership with the University of Manitoba, and providing funding
through bursaries, is something we're super excited about launching again. This is about
helping the future be realized and always keeping the art of the possible at the forefront, and
that's how you know we're really living our values and living our purpose.
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Speaker 2 24:33
Karen, this is a great conversation, and I could, I could easily stay on here for four hours, but I
know you have important things to do, so I'm going to go into kind of our closing traditions
here. The first one is, what's one thing you've changed your mind about recently, and why?
Speaker 1 24:50
You know, we were talking earlier about how I'm a mom of five, and I'll share with you that of
my five, we said they're all different, I have two boys. Boys who have disabilities, and one of
my sons has autism, and the other has Down syndrome, and having these two boys with
diverse strengths has changed my mind about a lot in the world, and so that's where I'm going
to go with my answer. I also think that what's changed my mind is a strength is not perhaps
what I used to think a strength was.
Speaker 2 25:30
Definitely changes over time, what you think is a strength in part of that youth and what you
align with and what you identify with through time, but absolutely,
Speaker 1 25:40
that's right, and so I'll say my guy with Down syndrome, I mean, boy, does he have strengths,
and going back to AI versus the human side, he's got great strengths on the human side of
asking great questions, simplifying things, and I'll tell you, he gives really good hugs, gives
really good hugs, and that human side, I mean, boy,
Speaker 2 26:04
it's beautiful.
Speaker 1 26:05
In today's day and age, we can't get enough of that.
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Speaker 2 26:07
Okay, so on the other side of that, what's one thing that you have not changed your mind
about, and you think that others should come to your way of thinking about
Speaker 1 26:16
it? I think the world is fast. I haven't changed my mind on the speed of which change is
happening, and I think that the world kind of gets it, but I'm not sure they understand the
magnitude, and so I think what AI is showcasing is that what used to be done in years is now
down to days, hours, and minutes, and I think that the pace of which change is going to happen
as we look over the next, and we'll use five years, we can't even imagine, and I think that the
world isn't quite there yet. I think they've got a little glimmer, but it hasn't impacted people's
daily lives, quite yet, and so I think speed is my answer.
Speaker 2 27:06
Well, I think that brings us to time. Karen, thank you so much for sharing your perspectives on
building a business where purpose and profit go hand in hand. Thank you very much. And to
our listeners, if this conversation sparked some interest or ideas, share it, share it with
somebody that might be of interest. Don't forget to subscribe and rate and follow for more.
We'll see you next time on CEO: Behind the Scenes.
27:29
Bye.